Class Notes: Week 10
John Larson shared some amazing stories with us. I'm sharing a couple more here:
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John Larson
o Parking meter – early career – winded up at Columbia to talk about storytelling
o Surprises/Reveals (John doesn't say anything and it all happens in medium/moment)
§ One meter in 10,000 sq miles
§ The meter moves
§ The mayor is the one behind it
o Beginning of career was parking meter then he went to network
§ Sewing Machine is end of career – first of only commercial
o In between parking meter and sewing machine is journalism career
§ Walk into any story, think of 25 options, choose what might be the most important storyline, cut out all the other crap, prove what you have to deliver, don’t tell me she is ambitious – show her sewing machines, and you have to execute and not work people to death
o Oklahoma Courthouse - thing John Larson had to do as an exercise a while ago
§ 300 photographers, editors, reporters all go there for a week for an assignment – run out and randomly picked and stories put up on a screen and critiqued
§ One of them pushed back – if you all are smart, shoot a story – thank god John’s story was good – opened up paper next morning – looked for new in Norman Oklahoma
§ Just finished a 2 million dollar renovation of courthouse
§ Courthouses are where marriage ceremonies occur – where divorce ceremonies occur or family court. Of all those little options, this one might have a decision that has power in it. Went out to courthouse and had 25 students with us for 2 hours. Took a look at it and talked about how to choose what might be powerful – of all possibilities, what might be most powerful.
§ Looking for marriages – thought it would be fine – supposed to be a marriage 40 minutes after they got their, but marriage cancelled. Most of students that were with them left because they thought there was no story. Started chatting up the clerks nad that’s when the story evolved.
§ When you are a producer, storyteller, journalist – walk into room and figure out what is powerful. When it started to evolve, you can’t make this shit up.
§ Quick Google search – change law to stop divorce, what is happening in this room speaks to a larger society – cool thing to show the room. Got to drop the mic at the end of it
o Questions about Oklahoma
§ How did you get permission to shoot these people?
· Bar was lower – never aired – oh this is what is going on here. We are not going to put this on the air. Doing it as part of a teaching exercise.
· 12 cities that ended up doing pieces on divorces because they had seen John Larson’s piece
· The punchline – you get people to trust you by being worthy of their trust. They can sense whether you are worthy of their trust. How delicately, share how difficult it is, in what you are saying and what you do – get better at that. Not manipulation, more about who you are.
· Totally understand – producer – so can we shoot over here? Can we still do some of this?
§ Every one of the reveals John Larson knew before the camera went on. Got good soundbytes because he knew beforehand.
· Started to ask about divorce – all rolling their eyes – notice the way it is written, all three of the clerks are not divorced. Eliminated all other info – narrowed focus just to divorce. Divorce court is right upstairs
· Chat up secretary with judge, do you have a morning break, 20 minutes – talk to judge about this? Clerks told me about divorce rates, etc, how this judge had done more divorces than any other judge in county
· Not going to be on TV – can we document this?
· What happens is that you have to allow the audience to participate in the reveal – knew all people did divorce but had to ask questions that people didn’t know.
o Sooner or later they would complain to mayor? Why is that? I am the mayor. Stir the pot. Usually people answer the question in stride. The subjects drive home, give punchline, not the narrator or reporter.
· Documentary – no narrative voice, all first person stuff. A lot of the thing is sexism – putting soundbytes in. Goal is to maximize, all numbers details, etc
§ Accurately portray level of importance of what happens here – in choice of words and how well you listen and look at them in the eye
· When they say no, do not suggest an alternative that is acceptable
· Yes, it’s negotiating your way in, but it is a lot about listening and establishing trust
· Larson Feedback on People
o You don’t know these people – asking them a favor to do an assignment – invading their privacy and they don’t owe you honesty, dark secrets, schmuck with a camera. That’s what John Larson describes himself as.
o They need to have a reason to do this – put into words why this is important. Care more about their restaurant then they ever dreamed. Have to care more about their restaurant.
o John McFee – nonfiction writer – six weeks ago – did piece in New Yorker – staff writer for New Yorker – Google it – 40,000 word pieces about oranges
§ Says writing is selection – what’s your next work?
§ You select what goes in and you have to decide what stays out. One criterion for all of this. If it doesn’t it stays out, it is all you got. Forget about market research. Write about subjects to see through all starts, stops, impediments along the way.
§ If you don’t give a shit, your audience won’t.
§ Can you find something in your own curiosity that gets you there?
· Wanted to talk about drawing story lines out of everyday events
o Flying coach – 25 years – people who sit next to him have amazing stories to tell – airborne confession – never going to see this person again in life – tell them stuff and don’t have to worry about repercussion. Heard stuff about affairs, failed businesses, you name it!
§ Started writing them down – one after another - powerful story. Shot a few of them.
§ Doing a thing for Newshour – why don’t we do a thing on the busiest travel day of the year
o These are personal narratives – immigrant story, American dream, patriotism
§ Seriously – every year you go to the statue of liberty?
§ All of a sudden – wind up with archives – better than that – real people sitting in front of you
§ Personal story lines - that they are the big deep things in our life
· 10 biggest stories in news in Detroit, then compare to 10 things in personal life
o All of us operate on these personal levels – care about whether or not a child succeeds, other stuff is news
o How do we move into documentary and remember personal stories on success, hope, etc
o Any way to cross storylines and do a piece on entrepreneurs but do it with vein of heart that crosses people
o Normandy – starts with name – NORMandy – Colombian – why that name? That’s the opening thing – guns of Normandy and then grandfather – people that were American before they were American – can’t make this stuff up
§ In the process of that story, shared a lot about himself – daughter, building relationship – didn’t know doing a story about it
§ Oh, it’s Bill Gates – so cool, right below the surface – most of the stories are 1 inch deep – bigger fish in the room, can you find one that is appropriate, can you earn a sense of trust so you can ask it
§ Do we want to have met them and seen their face before they pop them with the surprise – take a phrase from each one, get rid of everybody you don’t need – limit participation to one move
§ Could have cut out Ghost of Harvard – chopped Gates – off to side but mind-blowing – but how can you throw that away?
· Remember that these things are just below the surface – go into restaurant, widget factory, get basic facts of how it started – right below surface there are hopes, aspirations, people that have paid a price to make this happen – practice that you get better at
· Marshmallow
o Did she say anything that you didn’t put on camera?
o Why don’t you just cook the marshmallows in your house?
o Cookery? Two hour segments? $550 – how many marshmallows you going to sell? Profit margin? Debt with each marshmallow? How does that work?
o Didn’t want to push it too far – personal relationships with family – rapport
o Who did she learn to cook from?
o This is a feel good story – sweet story – marshmallow story – take best guess, show them that you have as much passion about their penalties – that you care as much about ingredients, sense it, and then treat sensitive stuff appropriately
· Give me an example of that – what is the recipe for a sacred moment. Cookies become something wider and bigger. Milton is fat – judging by waistline – can you have too many sacred moments? Cool looking guy
· Tapas – best opening line – sold weed out the back door
Anson Burtch
o Stories that Enson – world of disruption – storytellers that are much more important – one of things that he said – used to work for dateline when he used to work for investigative journalism
o Long time – advertising had a horrible reputation – move from advertising is move to sponsored content – bringing stories up
o Documentary filmmaking is more fertile – last places you can get paid to make art
o All kinds of things that can happen in space – Patagonia produced an hour long doc on whole thing – smart, aware to draw audience into brand – great in this world
o What’s the basic thing about the stories that grabs us? Emotion – anger, cute, etc
o Do everything from major brand campaigns to media – can’t just spew out message and say come to my hospital – do work for hospital chain in Florida called US Health
o Incurable cancer piece
§ Not very much different – Dolores – sat in house, b-roll
§ Cory – same thing on farm – spent day talking to him – asides, b-roll – 10x the amount of b-roll you think you need. No such thing as too much b-roll. 9 minute long story John showed
§ Need establishing, medium, closeup on details – 10,000 liquor bottles in house – doesn’t drink. Devastated couldn’t use it on the spot. (So you collect liquor bottles?)
§ Detail shots like that – rack focus are great. So you spend time with people – pre-interview, do all of that, get them comfortable. Visited twice before shoot day. Be as comfortable as possible before going with camera.
§ Focus in showing two things was authenticity – documentary storytelling is what people are after – BMW is first brand to say “We are going to do films.”
§ Lexus, Red Hat all have films – essentially documentaries – wonderful programs that are happening – research, program relies on Red Hat software – tangential – old days 30 second spot – Red Hat runs schoolboard – away from messaging and more towards storytelling.
o High School video
§ EXTRA gum – tie in is cheesy – viewed over 10 million times – power of storytelling – tugging at heartstrings, something that is powerful, example of brand
§ Got millions of views – advertising is place where desire to do work is coming together with commerce and getting paid – how do you do that? Where is that balance?
· Point out that rather than advertising, branding being a dirty word, but industry is moving towards quality content
· Make content that gets you interested on your own – Red Bull is putting money in extreme sports because young people do it – sponsor because target audience
§ Content that we want to see vs. content that Red Bull wanted to put out
o Blue Grass Radio Show in tiny college station
§ Listening area was 1.5 million people – most people don’t like Blue Grass – people take requests – all people listen – flooded with call – offering something that no one else is in
§ Get out of college – news is the only thing to do with radio/TV – moved to Brooklyn, NY – what do I do? Interviewed as news stations, radio stations (no jobs), and one guy goes you are into production – there is a 1000 ad agencies
§ Side projects are key to happiness – been doing this for a while – approached by folks that said NC is killing it with craft beer – want to do something with that
· Brewconomy.com – couple festivals coming up – no one got paid – happily worked on it – bring story – state that lost a lot of textile, furniture work – state is smart to realize craft beer is replacing these industries
§ Much more an economic film – side project – could not have done it without connections through regular job – got $25,000 of free filming for this for free
§ Called every shooter – said all I want is a day, can’t pay, it is about beer, come on out and let’s do it for fun. Called in a lot of favors – call me for next project. Do favors, networking is super important.
§ It’s not just your project, help out on other people’s projects, called me and said “Hey got this other idea”
§ Producer – one word oxymoron – don’t produce anything, didn’t shoot – someone has to marshall troops – here is what we are doing, here is when I need it by – glorified project manager, set out a vision, line up all the pieces, and work out the details (contracts, etc)
§ Brewconomy – 1.5 years – free time piece. Right now, animator that works has been giving one day projects – all about that time management – agency that puts it together.
§ Writes and art directors – good with copy, copywriter – John Larson is a writer, captures news stories and puts it together – need a TV campaign – UNC Healthcare – need a campaign so that art directors, creatives get an idea
§ Production – hire production companies, plenty of people in town that are just shooters, post-production, editors on producer side – Anson over years learned to have a lot more say in creative process than originally thought
o Encourage right after school to go find thing that interests you most and pursue that – talking about production companies and edit houses – need people willing to start at bottom, go from what is most interesting from get go
§ Lot less flexibility later on with families
o Anson’s brother does research and wants to work for a company and pursues them – doesn’t get a job – calls back, pursues and keeps knocking on door, gotten every single job he has wanted – doesn’t happen fast and it is a method.
o Got a friend that works at Comedy Central – had ideas and pitches – look at all these ideas I got – give me money to make it – that model is dead – world has changed
§ Go do it yourself, build an audience, that’s when channels will come – they don’t want a risk, they want an audience – need to be aware the world has changed – just do it – just start making it
§ Documentaries don’t have to be an hour
o Now commercial director based on short documentary – couple more things
o Kinda project that recharges batteries – Carson edited that spot – can do good work in commercial industry.
o Edit houses were not paying much – no work – oil and gas industry came to editors – ton of work for oil and gas (lot of editors didn’t want to do it)
§ Company wide meeting where owners threw it on table – huge project oil and gas – I won’t work on that
§ But no work – have to lay off – don’t have to lay people off for 6 months -1 year
§ Gonna do this to keep ourselves in business and make it through time
§ Did campaign – follow up – took up solar work to offset guilt
§ BP came after gulf spill, BP called – want to do spots – greenwashing – company was in good enogh financial standing to not do it
o Pick which stories to show is not cut and dry.
o Parking meter – early career – winded up at Columbia to talk about storytelling
o Surprises/Reveals (John doesn't say anything and it all happens in medium/moment)
§ One meter in 10,000 sq miles
§ The meter moves
§ The mayor is the one behind it
o Beginning of career was parking meter then he went to network
§ Sewing Machine is end of career – first of only commercial
o In between parking meter and sewing machine is journalism career
§ Walk into any story, think of 25 options, choose what might be the most important storyline, cut out all the other crap, prove what you have to deliver, don’t tell me she is ambitious – show her sewing machines, and you have to execute and not work people to death
o Oklahoma Courthouse - thing John Larson had to do as an exercise a while ago
§ 300 photographers, editors, reporters all go there for a week for an assignment – run out and randomly picked and stories put up on a screen and critiqued
§ One of them pushed back – if you all are smart, shoot a story – thank god John’s story was good – opened up paper next morning – looked for new in Norman Oklahoma
§ Just finished a 2 million dollar renovation of courthouse
§ Courthouses are where marriage ceremonies occur – where divorce ceremonies occur or family court. Of all those little options, this one might have a decision that has power in it. Went out to courthouse and had 25 students with us for 2 hours. Took a look at it and talked about how to choose what might be powerful – of all possibilities, what might be most powerful.
§ Looking for marriages – thought it would be fine – supposed to be a marriage 40 minutes after they got their, but marriage cancelled. Most of students that were with them left because they thought there was no story. Started chatting up the clerks nad that’s when the story evolved.
§ When you are a producer, storyteller, journalist – walk into room and figure out what is powerful. When it started to evolve, you can’t make this shit up.
§ Quick Google search – change law to stop divorce, what is happening in this room speaks to a larger society – cool thing to show the room. Got to drop the mic at the end of it
o Questions about Oklahoma
§ How did you get permission to shoot these people?
· Bar was lower – never aired – oh this is what is going on here. We are not going to put this on the air. Doing it as part of a teaching exercise.
· 12 cities that ended up doing pieces on divorces because they had seen John Larson’s piece
· The punchline – you get people to trust you by being worthy of their trust. They can sense whether you are worthy of their trust. How delicately, share how difficult it is, in what you are saying and what you do – get better at that. Not manipulation, more about who you are.
· Totally understand – producer – so can we shoot over here? Can we still do some of this?
§ Every one of the reveals John Larson knew before the camera went on. Got good soundbytes because he knew beforehand.
· Started to ask about divorce – all rolling their eyes – notice the way it is written, all three of the clerks are not divorced. Eliminated all other info – narrowed focus just to divorce. Divorce court is right upstairs
· Chat up secretary with judge, do you have a morning break, 20 minutes – talk to judge about this? Clerks told me about divorce rates, etc, how this judge had done more divorces than any other judge in county
· Not going to be on TV – can we document this?
· What happens is that you have to allow the audience to participate in the reveal – knew all people did divorce but had to ask questions that people didn’t know.
o Sooner or later they would complain to mayor? Why is that? I am the mayor. Stir the pot. Usually people answer the question in stride. The subjects drive home, give punchline, not the narrator or reporter.
· Documentary – no narrative voice, all first person stuff. A lot of the thing is sexism – putting soundbytes in. Goal is to maximize, all numbers details, etc
§ Accurately portray level of importance of what happens here – in choice of words and how well you listen and look at them in the eye
· When they say no, do not suggest an alternative that is acceptable
· Yes, it’s negotiating your way in, but it is a lot about listening and establishing trust
· Larson Feedback on People
o You don’t know these people – asking them a favor to do an assignment – invading their privacy and they don’t owe you honesty, dark secrets, schmuck with a camera. That’s what John Larson describes himself as.
o They need to have a reason to do this – put into words why this is important. Care more about their restaurant then they ever dreamed. Have to care more about their restaurant.
o John McFee – nonfiction writer – six weeks ago – did piece in New Yorker – staff writer for New Yorker – Google it – 40,000 word pieces about oranges
§ Says writing is selection – what’s your next work?
§ You select what goes in and you have to decide what stays out. One criterion for all of this. If it doesn’t it stays out, it is all you got. Forget about market research. Write about subjects to see through all starts, stops, impediments along the way.
§ If you don’t give a shit, your audience won’t.
§ Can you find something in your own curiosity that gets you there?
· Wanted to talk about drawing story lines out of everyday events
o Flying coach – 25 years – people who sit next to him have amazing stories to tell – airborne confession – never going to see this person again in life – tell them stuff and don’t have to worry about repercussion. Heard stuff about affairs, failed businesses, you name it!
§ Started writing them down – one after another - powerful story. Shot a few of them.
§ Doing a thing for Newshour – why don’t we do a thing on the busiest travel day of the year
o These are personal narratives – immigrant story, American dream, patriotism
§ Seriously – every year you go to the statue of liberty?
§ All of a sudden – wind up with archives – better than that – real people sitting in front of you
§ Personal story lines - that they are the big deep things in our life
· 10 biggest stories in news in Detroit, then compare to 10 things in personal life
o All of us operate on these personal levels – care about whether or not a child succeeds, other stuff is news
o How do we move into documentary and remember personal stories on success, hope, etc
o Any way to cross storylines and do a piece on entrepreneurs but do it with vein of heart that crosses people
o Normandy – starts with name – NORMandy – Colombian – why that name? That’s the opening thing – guns of Normandy and then grandfather – people that were American before they were American – can’t make this stuff up
§ In the process of that story, shared a lot about himself – daughter, building relationship – didn’t know doing a story about it
§ Oh, it’s Bill Gates – so cool, right below the surface – most of the stories are 1 inch deep – bigger fish in the room, can you find one that is appropriate, can you earn a sense of trust so you can ask it
§ Do we want to have met them and seen their face before they pop them with the surprise – take a phrase from each one, get rid of everybody you don’t need – limit participation to one move
§ Could have cut out Ghost of Harvard – chopped Gates – off to side but mind-blowing – but how can you throw that away?
· Remember that these things are just below the surface – go into restaurant, widget factory, get basic facts of how it started – right below surface there are hopes, aspirations, people that have paid a price to make this happen – practice that you get better at
· Marshmallow
o Did she say anything that you didn’t put on camera?
o Why don’t you just cook the marshmallows in your house?
o Cookery? Two hour segments? $550 – how many marshmallows you going to sell? Profit margin? Debt with each marshmallow? How does that work?
o Didn’t want to push it too far – personal relationships with family – rapport
o Who did she learn to cook from?
o This is a feel good story – sweet story – marshmallow story – take best guess, show them that you have as much passion about their penalties – that you care as much about ingredients, sense it, and then treat sensitive stuff appropriately
· Give me an example of that – what is the recipe for a sacred moment. Cookies become something wider and bigger. Milton is fat – judging by waistline – can you have too many sacred moments? Cool looking guy
· Tapas – best opening line – sold weed out the back door
Anson Burtch
o Stories that Enson – world of disruption – storytellers that are much more important – one of things that he said – used to work for dateline when he used to work for investigative journalism
o Long time – advertising had a horrible reputation – move from advertising is move to sponsored content – bringing stories up
o Documentary filmmaking is more fertile – last places you can get paid to make art
o All kinds of things that can happen in space – Patagonia produced an hour long doc on whole thing – smart, aware to draw audience into brand – great in this world
o What’s the basic thing about the stories that grabs us? Emotion – anger, cute, etc
o Do everything from major brand campaigns to media – can’t just spew out message and say come to my hospital – do work for hospital chain in Florida called US Health
o Incurable cancer piece
§ Not very much different – Dolores – sat in house, b-roll
§ Cory – same thing on farm – spent day talking to him – asides, b-roll – 10x the amount of b-roll you think you need. No such thing as too much b-roll. 9 minute long story John showed
§ Need establishing, medium, closeup on details – 10,000 liquor bottles in house – doesn’t drink. Devastated couldn’t use it on the spot. (So you collect liquor bottles?)
§ Detail shots like that – rack focus are great. So you spend time with people – pre-interview, do all of that, get them comfortable. Visited twice before shoot day. Be as comfortable as possible before going with camera.
§ Focus in showing two things was authenticity – documentary storytelling is what people are after – BMW is first brand to say “We are going to do films.”
§ Lexus, Red Hat all have films – essentially documentaries – wonderful programs that are happening – research, program relies on Red Hat software – tangential – old days 30 second spot – Red Hat runs schoolboard – away from messaging and more towards storytelling.
o High School video
§ EXTRA gum – tie in is cheesy – viewed over 10 million times – power of storytelling – tugging at heartstrings, something that is powerful, example of brand
§ Got millions of views – advertising is place where desire to do work is coming together with commerce and getting paid – how do you do that? Where is that balance?
· Point out that rather than advertising, branding being a dirty word, but industry is moving towards quality content
· Make content that gets you interested on your own – Red Bull is putting money in extreme sports because young people do it – sponsor because target audience
§ Content that we want to see vs. content that Red Bull wanted to put out
o Blue Grass Radio Show in tiny college station
§ Listening area was 1.5 million people – most people don’t like Blue Grass – people take requests – all people listen – flooded with call – offering something that no one else is in
§ Get out of college – news is the only thing to do with radio/TV – moved to Brooklyn, NY – what do I do? Interviewed as news stations, radio stations (no jobs), and one guy goes you are into production – there is a 1000 ad agencies
§ Side projects are key to happiness – been doing this for a while – approached by folks that said NC is killing it with craft beer – want to do something with that
· Brewconomy.com – couple festivals coming up – no one got paid – happily worked on it – bring story – state that lost a lot of textile, furniture work – state is smart to realize craft beer is replacing these industries
§ Much more an economic film – side project – could not have done it without connections through regular job – got $25,000 of free filming for this for free
§ Called every shooter – said all I want is a day, can’t pay, it is about beer, come on out and let’s do it for fun. Called in a lot of favors – call me for next project. Do favors, networking is super important.
§ It’s not just your project, help out on other people’s projects, called me and said “Hey got this other idea”
§ Producer – one word oxymoron – don’t produce anything, didn’t shoot – someone has to marshall troops – here is what we are doing, here is when I need it by – glorified project manager, set out a vision, line up all the pieces, and work out the details (contracts, etc)
§ Brewconomy – 1.5 years – free time piece. Right now, animator that works has been giving one day projects – all about that time management – agency that puts it together.
§ Writes and art directors – good with copy, copywriter – John Larson is a writer, captures news stories and puts it together – need a TV campaign – UNC Healthcare – need a campaign so that art directors, creatives get an idea
§ Production – hire production companies, plenty of people in town that are just shooters, post-production, editors on producer side – Anson over years learned to have a lot more say in creative process than originally thought
o Encourage right after school to go find thing that interests you most and pursue that – talking about production companies and edit houses – need people willing to start at bottom, go from what is most interesting from get go
§ Lot less flexibility later on with families
o Anson’s brother does research and wants to work for a company and pursues them – doesn’t get a job – calls back, pursues and keeps knocking on door, gotten every single job he has wanted – doesn’t happen fast and it is a method.
o Got a friend that works at Comedy Central – had ideas and pitches – look at all these ideas I got – give me money to make it – that model is dead – world has changed
§ Go do it yourself, build an audience, that’s when channels will come – they don’t want a risk, they want an audience – need to be aware the world has changed – just do it – just start making it
§ Documentaries don’t have to be an hour
o Now commercial director based on short documentary – couple more things
o Kinda project that recharges batteries – Carson edited that spot – can do good work in commercial industry.
o Edit houses were not paying much – no work – oil and gas industry came to editors – ton of work for oil and gas (lot of editors didn’t want to do it)
§ Company wide meeting where owners threw it on table – huge project oil and gas – I won’t work on that
§ But no work – have to lay off – don’t have to lay people off for 6 months -1 year
§ Gonna do this to keep ourselves in business and make it through time
§ Did campaign – follow up – took up solar work to offset guilt
§ BP came after gulf spill, BP called – want to do spots – greenwashing – company was in good enogh financial standing to not do it
o Pick which stories to show is not cut and dry.